Friday, April 21, 2006

"NOW Do You Believe It?"

Read Peter Porcupine's blog-article "NOW Do You Believe It?" Excerpt:
"...The religious zeal of Moussaoui is real, sincere and deadly. If we fail to execute him, it will be percieved [sic] as a signal of our inherent weakness in the Muslim [world], and will ultimately cause the death and destruction of millions...."

106 Comments:

At 4/21/2006 11:06 AM, Blogger gandalf said...

this man should NOT be executed, that is what he wants, he feels he will become shaheed, this must be denied him.

better have him working on a pig farm for life, that will humilliate him and Islam and he will never go to paradise, for such a man this is worse than death

 
At 4/21/2006 11:28 AM, Blogger Brooke said...

Nah, go ahead and kill him...but first, roll the bullet in pig fat.

 
At 4/21/2006 11:33 AM, Blogger MonicaR said...

Fire up Old Sparky.

 
At 4/21/2006 11:40 AM, Blogger Mr. Beamish the Instablepundit said...

ZM should be executed if found guilty of the charges he's been indicted with.

It is a greater victory for Islam if we set aside a due punishment out of fear of creating "martyrs." The fact that anyone would consider what the Islamic point of view in regard to his punishment would be is more cultural imperialism than I can stand.

Execute the bastard. Dead is dead.

 
At 4/21/2006 11:41 AM, Blogger Freedomnow said...

Justice will be served. Whether its a life sentence or execution.

 
At 4/21/2006 11:43 AM, Blogger Mr. Beamish the Instablepundit said...

Now I disagree with FreedomNow. A life sentence is not justice. Only his death will fulfill the demand for justice.

It's not our fault the Islamic world doesn't have the technology to bring 3000 people back from the dead.

 
At 4/21/2006 11:47 AM, Blogger beakerkin said...

I think a nice beheading is in order. We can sing " You light up my life" or any song from Yentyl

 
At 4/21/2006 12:10 PM, Anonymous Mustang said...

All ready on the right; All ready on the left; All ready on the firing line . . .

 
At 4/21/2006 12:16 PM, Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

Millions of lives depend on our executing a mentally ill man who couldn't make Mohammed Atta's A team.

Millions of lives.

What a freakin' idiot. Man, you folks have a talent for hyperbole.

Millions of lives depend on executing a mentally ill man. You pathetic demented schmucks.

 
At 4/21/2006 1:47 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

ducky,

Yep.

-FJ

 
At 4/21/2006 2:24 PM, Anonymous themerrywidow said...

He's not mentally ill Ducky, he also refuses to accept that assessment! He points back to and quotes from the koran, it is a religious obligation.

tmw

 
At 4/21/2006 2:26 PM, Blogger American Crusader said...

I agree with freedomnow...either way justice will be served.
Executing him will only get him what he wants like gandalf had said. Leaving him in isolation for the next 40 years isn't getting off easily.

 
At 4/21/2006 2:26 PM, Blogger WomanHonorThyself said...

There are no words for a man like this...whatever his Fate will be..the damage is so done...he does not deserve to breath air and enjoy his 5 senses..Let him go meet his Maker.we all surmise whats in store for him there eh?

 
At 4/21/2006 2:33 PM, Blogger Peter Porcupine said...

AOW - I've corrected the typo. Thanks for the link.

To all of your commenters - PLEASE. RESPECT the sincerity of this man's hatred. Don't project your own reactions on to him. He is not deranged just because he was involved in a plot to kill as many women and infidels as possible.

He's just a terrorist.

 
At 4/21/2006 2:42 PM, Blogger beakerkin said...

Ducky

Lets see next on the list is your friends at Code Pink. Lets see aiding and abeting the enemy in Falujah is still treason.

Try the leadership of Code Pink and then carry out the law.

 
At 4/21/2006 3:56 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sorry folks, but only DEATH will deliver the DEATH message back to the DEATH messengers who have made it preferred approach to deal DEATH to us. Their willingness to use TERROR as a weapon is based upon their assumption that we are WEAK and will SUBMIT, that we fear DEATH. If we let him "live", they will take that as a sign of WEAKNESS, NOT STRENGTH. Admitted unrepentant killers should be EXECUTED. Future terrorists who fail in their efforts to commit DEATH and DESTRUCTION and MURDER of innocents should face an even HARSHER judgement than what they have dealt us. Not only should Moussaoui DIE, but it should be very slow and very painful. Breaking on the wheel before drawing and quartering would be MOST appropriate.

-FJ

 
At 4/21/2006 3:57 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

...but that was just my opinion.

-FJ

 
At 4/21/2006 4:17 PM, Blogger David Schantz said...

I'm going along with Brooke on this. I might take it one step further and have it televised.

God Bless America, God Save The Republic.

 
At 4/21/2006 5:21 PM, Blogger Iran Watch said...

Do you really think that Islamic terrorist would take a life sentence as a sign of weakness fj? I'm not sure what difference it would make to them.
Myself, I'd like to see his execution televised but not for those reasons.
He is an unrepentant killer who deserves nothing better.
And Ducky, even if he didn't actually kill anybody he still has blood on his hands. He was just too stupid to fulfill his part.

 
At 4/21/2006 6:16 PM, Blogger MissingLink said...

that is what he wants, he feels he will become shaheed, this must be denied him.

It's not about him it's about other fanatics like him.
Execution is always considered as reserverd for the weak in Islam.
To show the strenght of the victorious forces.
This is why "they" do execute thier vixtims so happily.
In the eyes of other pious Muslims executed person could NEVER be a martyr.
Martyrs die in battles (even if it is a suicide bombing) but execution is actually very humiliatibg to Muslims.

 
At 4/21/2006 6:26 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yes I do, Iran Watch. Just call me a "Shock and Awe" kinda guy.

-FJ

 
At 4/21/2006 6:41 PM, Blogger Mr. Beamish the Instablepundit said...

FJ,

No elaborate execution ritual need be performed, although I'm quite partial to locking him in a room of New Yorkers armed with pick axes.

Dead is dead.

 
At 4/21/2006 6:45 PM, Blogger gandalf said...

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/reference/glossary/term.SHAHEED.html

Shaheed is someone who dies in the way of allah, thus being killed by an enemy, albeit a nation and not an individual, and especially if that nation is perceived as an enemy of Islam, then the person will be Shaheed.

The concept of Islam has to be destroyed, Muslims are convinced that Allah protects them.

Communism was not defeated by killing every communist, it was shown to be a flawed concept, the people did the rest

I personally would lower this man int a vat of hydrochloric acid an inch at a time but that would not destroy thier belief in Allah and all that goes with that belief

 
At 4/21/2006 6:47 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I want to install a "memory" in their derranged little brains that they will NEVER forget. One that will become part of their gene pool, and will be passed down from generation to generation. One that will last thousands and thousands of years. Something that says..."THAT is what happens to those who are tempted by power.... and FAIL."

It took a thousands of years of domination by the "blond beasts" of Europe to civilize the world...and create the first "Christian". It took terror on a scale unimagined, to create the first "Christian"... an animal soooo terrified, he didn't need a master standing over him with a whip to be willing to subject himself to the rule of law... one who developed instead, a conscience. (Nietzsche, "Genealogy of Morals")

We Germans certainly do not think of ourselves as a particularly cruel and hard-hearted people, even less as particularly careless people who live only in the present. But have a look at our old penal code in order to understand how much trouble it took on this earth to breed a "People of Thinkers" (by that I mean the peoples of Europe, among whom today we still find a maximum of trust, seriousness, tastelessness, and practicality, and who with these characteristics have a right to breed all sorts of European mandarins). These Germans have used terrible means to make themselves a memory in order to attain mastery over their vulgar and brutally crude basic instincts. Think of the old German punishments, for example, stoning (even the legend lets the mill stone fall on the head of the guilty person), breaking on the wheel (the unique invention and specialty of the German genius in the area of punishment!), impaling on a stake, ripping people apart or stamping them to death with horses ("quartering"), boiling the criminal in oil or wine (still done in the fourteenth and fifteenth centuries), the well-loved practice of flaying ("cutting flesh off in strips"), carving flesh out of the chest, along with, of course, covering the offender with honey and leaving him to the flies in the burning sun.

With the help of such images and procedures people finally retained five or six "I will not's" in their memory, and so far as these precepts were concerned they gave their word in order to live with the advantages of society—and that was that! With the assistance of this sort of memory people finally came to "reason"! Ah, reason, seriousness, mastery over emotions, the whole gloomy business called reflection, all these privileges and ceremonies of human beings—how expensive they were! How much blood and horror is the basis for all "good things."


-FJ

 
At 4/21/2006 7:39 PM, Blogger Elmer's Brother said...

Admitted unrepentant killers should be EXECUTED. Future terrorists who fail in their efforts to commit DEATH and DESTRUCTION and MURDER of innocents should face an even HARSHER judgement than what they have dealt us. Not only should Moussaoui DIE, but it should be very slow and very painful. Breaking on the wheel before drawing and quartering would be MOST appropriate.

Right on FJ

 
At 4/21/2006 10:09 PM, Blogger nanc said...

justice will be served if we do it brooke's way. i'll cook his last meal...where's warren when you need a good poison soup recipe?

 
At 4/22/2006 7:01 AM, Blogger LASunsett said...

I say life in prison without parole, but with one condition. He goes to the general population. There, the natural course of events will play out and the government will save a bundle of money, in the process.

But this is just too good to pass up:

Millions of lives depend on executing a mentally ill man. You pathetic demented schmucks.


Translation:

He should get probation, with psychiatric treatment at the government's expense, because he is a victim of U.S. hegemonic oppression.

 
At 4/22/2006 7:15 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Since when does what a convicted criminal WANT play into his punishment? Just think of the possibililties on that one, and start applying that principle to any other egregious criminal which comes to mind. Dahmer? Manson?

Sometimes extremely aberrant behavior has nothing to do with insanity but has everything to do with evil or pure meanness--or a murderous ideology. The term "insanity" is much abused, IMO.

 
At 4/22/2006 9:11 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Not wanting to start an argument with you always, but don't you think that what a criminal "wants" plays into the type of crime he commits and then also, perhaps, the type of punishment he desires?

So of course, if someone actually believed that "reform" or possibly "treatment" of the criminal were possible (or even a desirable goal), then perhaps taking the criminal's "wants" into account in meting out a "corrective" punishment might prove useful. Do I believe that our "current" criminal justice and medical systems might be able to reform the "moose"? No, I don't.

But of course, if one felt that NO reform of the actual criminal himself were possible, then certainly the actual criminal's wants and desires would have no bearing on the question of punishment unless one then believed it possible to deter "like-minded" or "similar" individuals from committing the same crime. Do I believe that the like-minded suicide terrorist recruits of Osama bin Laden will likely be in anyway deterred from committing a crime against America if we kill the moose? No, not really.

If it isn't possible to "reform" moose himself, or influence the actions of those "like" him, why would I possibly still want to kill him horribly, slowly, and painfully?

Well first of all, it might give me, and not the moose, the pleasure and great feeling of cruel & sadistic power that HE actually desires for himself and perhaps make him finally come to REALIZE that I wield it- not him, but secondly, it might make people who are not like-minded to the moose, "fear" me. And as Machiavelli once stated, it is better to be feared, than loved.

For what are the chances of those "close" to thinking like the moose ever "loving" me "more"? I think that they are close to zero, regardless of what I do to the moose...and the chances that members of "other" nations who are completly unlike in their thinking processes (if there actually are any of them) will ever "love us more", and should not be forced to think twice about betraying us for whatever we do or don't do to the moose, are also, IMO about zero.

So what is left? Denying him what he wants. Breaking him so that he understands, before he dies, the REALITY that he is nothing and holds no power, and that his dreams for his people were all merely illusory fantasies... that like him, I have the will and power to crush him, them, or anybody else who wishes to challenge me, like so many bugs.

Or possibly releasing him outright, sending a message to him and all those in the world who seek after power and domination that they are free to challenge me, but that I have no fear of them, and perhaps making my so-called "friends" in the world wonder what I'm up to, but think that it's possibly okay for them to conspire against me, for nothing will happen to them if they are caught doing so...

Or simply lock him away, business as usual causing no one any more or less concern about struggles for power in the world than what lead to the actions and desires which prompted the moose to act as he did in the first place.

What did the "moose" want originally? What does the moose want now? Is there anything that can be done to "change" it? Is there anything to be done to influence how people think, or don't think, about it in the future?

-FJ

 
At 4/22/2006 9:36 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Joseph de Maistre "On the Executioner".

Upon what pedestal does the foundation of all state power rest? If that pedestal is removed, wherin lies the state?

What is the fasces? What does it symbolize?

-FJ

 
At 4/22/2006 11:32 AM, Blogger Cubed © said...

I vote for execution.

Ordinarily, I'm not a fan of the death penalty. I'm no "warm-fuzzy" about criminals, in that I firmly believe that anyone who takes the life of another for any reason other than self-defense waives his right to his own life.

My problem with the death penalty - ordinarily - is that even when trying very hard not to, we make mistakes, and while most mistakes can be corrected, an innocent dead person cannot be revived.

My concerns about the death penalty were heightened when, with the advent of the use of DNA testing, many prisoners were released from death row, having been shown to be innocent, despite the absolute certainty of their guilt by the men and women sitting on the juries that convicted them.

That having been said, Moussaoui should be executed.

One argument against execution is that he would die a martyr, but I have heard scholarly opinions saying that since he dies a prisoner in the hand of the enemy, and not in battle against the infidel, he doesn't qualify for martyr status.

Another argument against execution is that he is mentally ill, and we shouldn't execute the mentally ill.

Folks, there are strict medical definitions of mental illness; being a Muslim isn't in the Diagnostic Manual, trust me. Muslims are evil and weird, but they aren't psychotic.

My argument FOR EXECUTION lies in the fact that Moussaoui has an unremitting goal, on moral grounds (remember, the Muslims have a moral code where the "standard of the good" is not "life," as ours is, but rather, the "spread of Islam" by unrestricted means, up to and including murder and mayhem), to kill as many of those who don't subscribe to his belief system as he can.

If he remains imprisoned but alive, the "Arab Street" and Muslims world-wide will take up the campaign to free him by stepping up their usual "un-mutual" behavior. This will include the ususal terrorist strikes on American interests, both here and abroad, as well as the kidnapping, torture, and killing of Americans. So long as Moussaoui remains alive, that will continue.

If we do execute him, that same behavior will occur, of course, but it will eventually die out, much as the Khartoonifada temper tantrums died out.

 
At 4/22/2006 11:36 AM, Blogger Mr. Beamish the Instablepundit said...

I'd be content with a Civis Americanus sum policy.

We're not out to save the world from Islamic terrorism. We're out to engender the idea that killing American citizens is a very bad idea.

Kill all the non-Americans you want, but we will fight you to the last man if you breathe wrong on an American.

 
At 4/22/2006 12:14 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
don't you think that what a criminal "wants" plays into the type of crime he commits and then also, perhaps, the type of punishment he desires?

I don't see Moussaoui as desirous of punishment, particularly at the hands of a Western justice-system. He wants to commit heinous deeds, however. I'd go so far as to say that he is immoral--at least as far as Western morality is concerned. Also, he never intended to get caught as is often theorized about some serial killers like Bundy and Son of Sam.

Moussaoui remains committed to his jihadist fanaticism and has made the decision that his ethos (Kill all infidels) is the right ethos. And just where did he learn this ethos? Not all by himself, that's for sure. I think that he really believes that the future of his eternal soul is determined by killing infidels. How can one counter that belief and such a level of commitment? Walid Phares' book Future Jihad provides some clues, but not all the answers, IMO.

What I implied in my earlier statement was my underlying disdain of trying to understand the enemy and, thereby, worrying about his sensibilities to the point of courting our own defeat.

As a general rule, I'm not into the touchie-feelie method of justice. And as far as rehabilitation goes, I'd like to see that restricted to drug addicts, with a kind of tough-love approach. Some call that "bottoming out."

Moussaoui is not going to "bottom out" because he's not ready to work a 12-step program (I'm being a bit snide here, but the analogy might fit anyway). He truly believes that jihad is the best of all submissions to the will of Allah. His heart has hardened, and he revels in his addiction. Therefore, no rehabilitation is possible.

Now, how to convince others like Moussaoui that they are barbaric and cruel, "without natural affection"? I'm not sure we CAN [Could we "convince" Hitler?], but we surely can make the consequences ugly. If we make excuses and/or turn the other cheek, we'll still be faced with the will-of-Allah chant and evince weakness which will be turned against us.

I've never thought much of the capital-punishment-as-a-deterrent argument. And Cubed has made a good point in a previous comment:

If he remains imprisoned but alive, the "Arab Street" and Muslims world-wide will take up the campaign to free him...

And Beamish has also made an excellent point:

We're not out to save the world from Islamic terrorism. We're out to engender the idea that killing American citizens is a very bad idea.

Now I'm off to read the Maistre link. But I'll leave you with this question: How would the ancients have dealt with the likes of Moussaoui?

 
At 4/22/2006 12:19 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
That "Executioner" link is something to think about. Is the executioner the strong man which keeps people in line? Perhaps, if a life-cult is esteemed. But when a death-cult is the preferred way, what purpose does the executioner really serve?

Off to Beak's now, to see what's going on with the Duck Roast.

 
At 4/22/2006 4:36 PM, Blogger American Crusader said...

"an innocent dead person cannot be revived."

Truth is, a good prosecutor could get a ham sandwich convicted of murder, but in this case, they clearly have their man. He

 
At 4/23/2006 10:18 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

The short answer to what the ancients would do lies here

The longer answer...here

-FJ

 
At 4/23/2006 10:52 AM, Blogger Brooke said...

Whether or not he thinks he is shaheed is irrelevant.

He is a murderous maniac; a terrorist.
Kill him in a way that will humiliate him and other Muslims. Make an example out of him. Let others know what their fate will be if caught.

The bullet in pig fat would satisfy our constitutional directive against cruel and unusual punishment (quick and painless, and again, his beliefs are not our problem), and would humiliate him beyond repair.

This isn't about honoring death, or life; it is about punishment for a crime. What other punishment would fit the crime of taking part in the murder of 3,000 innocents; civilians, women, and children.

I'm all for using this as a nice way to deter terrorists...
http://binbacon.com/

 
At 4/23/2006 12:52 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
Thank you. I'll check those links later. Right now, I'm shutting down the computer for a while. It's Sunday afternoon!

 
At 4/23/2006 1:18 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I suspect that the electrons on your hard-drive will keep for a while before they need moving again. Have a great day!

-FJ

 
At 4/23/2006 2:24 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

erratum,

"...before their orbits need adjusting again."

-FJ

 
At 4/23/2006 3:13 PM, Blogger Avenging Apostate said...

I was going to comment here about this in detail but I thought this stuff is HOT for a post. The views people share here are very common. You will get the answer to them in my post.

Right now, though, I say put him to death, that's the best thing to do right now. My post will explain in detail. I will inform here whenever I post the article about this.

PS: Sorry Always on Watch, couldn't drop by, I was busy with my exams. More exams coming up next month, but till then, I will be around (I think!).

 
At 4/23/2006 3:24 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I suspect that in a death-cult like Islam, the executioner is meant to symbolize the righteous wrath of allah (as if allah couldn't do his own dirty work, you know, a plague or pox on the miscreants or something), but in reality serves to prop up the strong-man (caliph or sultan) who is, after all, simply engaged in doing allah's work (LOL!).[actually, I'm sure it runs a bit deeper than that, maintenance of an ordered realm, caliph selected by allah as agent, etc]

But in a sovereign "earthly" state (nation or country), the executioner represents that particular state's right to use deadly force, both to protect, and to punish her enemies. The blade of the axe, and not merely the tied bundle of sticks/whips that make up the fasces.

And if the state has no ability to do same, then the state will soon either succumb to her enemies, for soon she will no longer be empowered to employ the use of force at all (which IMO is the ONLY thing a government agncy or agent should be doing... employing "force") to accomplish anything, even defend herself... and stronger and less timid men will usurp her rights and bring back their own executioner.... or she (alma mater) will break down due to inner turmoils initiated by the demands for rights and freedom from her mesmerized populace.... allowing a new "native" strongman to emerge... Mr. xxx(?????) LOL!

-FJ

 
At 4/23/2006 10:24 PM, Blogger City Troll said...

Just shoot him and end the bulls*it

 
At 4/23/2006 11:10 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Avenging Apostate,
I am relieved to see you back again. I was worried.

Exams can be all-consuming. I understand because, as a teacher, I GIVE exams. Sometimes my students groan under the load.

Do well on those exams, and stay safe!

I'll check Pedestrian Infidel for your comments on the Moussaoui case and look forward to reading your post.

 
At 4/23/2006 11:17 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
I suspect that the electrons on your hard-drive will keep for a while before they need moving again.

Those electrons waited for me, but now I'm miles behind. I'll catch up, though.

Today, I managed to catch up on getting a nap [LOL] and grading some papers. Next up--getting course grades done. I'll start nibbling away at the latter this week, even though not all the work is in and evaluated. Getting grades out is so time-consuming! But I can at least get started on some of the narratives, which specify both strengths and weaknesses. At least the forms I'm using are the ones I myself designed.

if the state has no ability to do same, then the state will soon either succumb to her enemies, for soon she will no longer be empowered to employ the use of force at all...

Then, anarchy?

 
At 4/23/2006 11:24 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

City Troll,
Succinct and well-expressed.

 
At 4/24/2006 8:33 AM, Anonymous Debbie said...

I'm a true believer. He needs to be 'toasted', and very soon. We do NOT want him in prison for the rest of his live, preaching Islam and converting new jihadists who will be released, join local mosques, and try to destroy us. KILL him.

 
At 4/24/2006 10:08 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

From this source:

...[F]ailure to execute Moussaoui will demonstrate a severe lack of resolve on our part – a lack of resolve which Islamists will note carefully. Sparing Moussaoui may be merciful from our perspective, but it is weakness to Islamists. When Islamists sense weakness, they take full advantage: there’s a reason Bin Laden and his ilk cited the American pullouts from Lebanon and Somalia as evidence that the United States could be directly attacked with little consequence. The Islamist perspective is uncomplicated: if you cut a tiger, the tiger responds in anger; if you cut a paper tiger, there is no response. Sparing Moussaoui’s life, allowing him to send out crazed religious missives from prison while dining and watching cable television on the taxpayer dollar, is the mark of a paper tiger. If a lifetime of halal food and Oprah is the result of being “brought to justice,” Islamists don’t see much to fear....

 
At 4/24/2006 10:45 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Brooke,
I just got around to check that BinBacon link. What a hoot!

Sounds like a plan: The bullet in pig fat would satisfy our constitutional directive against cruel and unusual punishment (quick and painless, and again, his beliefs are not our problem), and would humiliate him beyond repair.

 
At 4/24/2006 1:56 PM, Blogger Anum Mahktar said...

Yes, only in America can you be saved by execution of any crazy man. We you feel safer in your beds at night now if he is killed. Stupid stupid stupid stupid

 
At 4/24/2006 1:56 PM, Blogger Anum Mahktar said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

 
At 4/24/2006 1:59 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Who wants to feel safer anum? I just want to enjoy the pleasure of ripping him limb from limb...

-FJ

 
At 4/24/2006 7:50 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

I'll forego the temptation to say what is really STUPID. Those who know me will get my drift, and those whose ears are stopped won't hear anyway.

 
At 4/24/2006 7:51 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Anum's criticism of American execution is strange--or something.

 
At 4/25/2006 10:55 AM, Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

Why would it be seen as a sign of weakness? Sharia allows for the aggrieved to pardon a murderer.

What is striking about all you shariaphobes is that you don't have even a preliminary understanding. Do you find comfort in ignorance.

 
At 4/25/2006 3:15 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Only in yours. So is the moose going to ask for a pardon from the 300 million Americans he was attempting to terrorize? Or is it your position that since he was "caught", that there was "no harm, no fow(u)l"?

Sometimes your ignorance is astounding, mr. ducky.

-FJ

 
At 4/25/2006 3:17 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Perahps he should petition the families of the the 3,000+ WTC victims. But if ONE says thumb downs, I get to gut him.

-FJ

 
At 4/25/2006 3:53 PM, Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

No Farmer, I am simply stating that this "sign of weakness" idea is something that a right winger pulled out of his ass. Lot of them running around claiming that they have a grasp of islam and sharia.

 
At 4/25/2006 5:06 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Well, no argument there. I say we fry him for the simple pleasure of doing it.

-FJ

 
At 4/25/2006 7:39 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Guilty as charged.

-FJ

 
At 4/25/2006 8:17 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Avenging Apostate over at Pedestrian Infidel is certainly qualified to speak to this subject. AA has mentioned that he plans a post on Moussaoui. I'll watch for it.

Yesterday, AA has this to say, in an earlier comment here:

I was going to comment here about this in detail but I thought this stuff is HOT for a post. The views people share here are very common. You will get the answer to them in my post.

Right now, though, I say put him to death, that's the best thing to do right now. My post will explain in detail. I will inform here whenever I post the article about this.

 
At 4/25/2006 9:01 PM, Anonymous the merry widow said...

A phobia is an "unnatural" fear, concern on the other hand is wise!

tmw

 
At 4/25/2006 10:10 PM, Blogger Pim's Ghost said...

Merry Widow, exactly. Pig fat bullet, perfect. Anum repeating the word "stupid", appropriate. Ducky acting like he know more than others here even though he's obviously a right-wing blog addict, typical.

How modern of a definition of "cruel and unsusal punishment" must be used? I know that there have been more recent precedents. I don't this guy to get what he wants, but if he could be executed in a humilating way (as no doubt many on 9/11 died) then let's devise a new execution for him. No more of this lethal injection nonsense. He should suffer, whether he is allowed to live or die.

 
At 4/26/2006 5:46 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Pim,

That is an absolutely BRILLIANT idea. You know how liberals LOVE the idea of "change" and "innovation". And we all know how they LOVE to try and "shame" us into NOT doing what is right. Sounds like the "perfect" way to package our new "Death for Terror" execution sentence.

-FJ

 
At 4/26/2006 11:49 AM, Blogger Avenging Apostate said...

I have put up a post over at Pedestrian Infidel about the comments that I read here.

 
At 4/26/2006 7:09 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Avenging Apostate's posting is here.

 
At 4/27/2006 8:23 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

GREAT post AA! from Frank Herbert's "Dune" series...

Muad'Dib learned rapidly because his first training was in how to learn. And the first lesson of all was the basic trust that he could learn. It's shocking to find how many people do not believe they can learn, and how many more believe learning to be difficult. Muad'Dib knew that every experience carries its lesson. -- from The Humanity of Muad'Dib by the Princess Irulan

Muad'Dib could indeed see the Future, but you must understand the limits of this power. Think of sight. You have eyes, yet cannot see without light. If you are on the floor of a valley, you cannot see beyond your valley. Just so, Muad'Dib could not always choose to look across the mysterious terrain. He tells us that a single obscure decision of prophecy, perhaps the choice of one word over another, could change the entire aspect of the future. He tells us "The vision of time is broad, but when you pass through it, time becomes a narrow door." And always, he fought the temptation to choose a clear, safe course, warning "That path leads ever down into stagnation." -- from Arrakis Awakening by the Princess Irulan

The Fremen were supreme in that quality the ancients called "spannungsbogen" — which is the self-imposed delay between desire for a thing and the act of reaching out to grasp that thing. --from The Wisdom of Muad'Dib by the Princess Irulan (and William Shakespeare, "Hamlet")

Arrakis teaches the attitude of the knife — chopping off what's incomplete and saying: "Now it's complete because it's ended here." -- from Collected Sayings of Muad'Dib by the Princess Irulan

In shield fighting, one moves fast on defense, slow on attack. Attack has the sole purpose of tricking the opponent into a misstep, setting him up for the attack sinister. The shield turns the fast blow, admits the slow kindjal! -- Gurney Halleck, to Paul Atreides

He will take to the ways of the Fremen as if he were born to them. --Liet-Kynes recalling the words of the prophecy of the Mahdi upon seeing Paul put on a Fremen suit without instruction.

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 8:33 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
AA makes the case, doesn't he?

 
At 4/27/2006 8:33 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"He was warrior and mystic, ogre and saint, the fox and the innocent, chivalrous, ruthless, less than a god, more than a man. There is no measuring Muad'Dib's motives by ordinary standards. In the moment of his triumph, he saw the death prepared for him, yet he accepted the treachery. Can you say he did this out of a sense of justice? Whose justice, then? Remember, we speak now of the Muad'Dib who ordered battle drums made from his enemies' skins, the Muad'Dib who denied the conventions of his ducal past with a wave of the hand, saying merely: "I am the Kwisatz Haderach. That is reason enough." --from Arrakis Awakening by the Princess Irulan


But let us not rail about justice as long as we have arms and the freedom to use them. --Duke Leto

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 8:35 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Indeed.

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 9:06 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

You know what archers of Elsinore say...

The longer the span of the bow, the deeper the arrow strikes!

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 9:20 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

and Henry V...

Sure, we thank you.
My learned lord, we pray you to proceed
And justly and religiously unfold
Why the law Salique that they have in France
Or should, or should not, bar us in our claim:
And God forbid, my dear and faithful lord,
That you should fashion, wrest, or bow your reading,
Or nicely charge your understanding soul

With opening titles miscreate, whose right
Suits not in native colours with the truth;
For God doth know how many now in health
Shall drop their blood in approbation
Of what your reverence shall incite us to.
Therefore take heed how you impawn our person,
How you awake our sleeping sword of war:
We charge you, in the name of God, take heed;
For never two such kingdoms did contend
Without much fall of blood; whose guiltless drops
Are every one a woe, a sore complaint
'Gainst him whose wrong gives edge unto the swords
That make such waste in brief mortality.
Under this conjuration, speak, my lord;
For we will hear, note and believe in heart
That what you speak is in your conscience wash'd
As pure as sin with baptism.


-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 9:22 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sorry for the digression AA, but some of always' students are reading Hamlet and they need to account for Hamet's "delays" in acting upon his thoughts.

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 9:23 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"spannungsbogen" - The length of the bow.

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 9:24 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Now my arms are tired! I guess I couldn't hold it any more.

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 9:25 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Maybe I need a compound bow. Anybody got a pulley?

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 9:31 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I must be "high strung".

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 9:41 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

...but I don't think I'm much of a Fremen.

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 9:55 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

...although I'd like to believe I'm a free man.

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 10:08 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Rocky Horror Picture Show, 1975...

Frank:

So - come up to the lab,
And see what's on the slab.
I see you shiver with antici --- pation.

But maybe the rain
Isn't really to blame.
So I'll remove the cause.
But not the symptom.


;-)

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 10:21 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once. --Albert Einstein

G_d works in "mysterious ways".

-FJ

 
At 4/27/2006 9:31 PM, Blogger nanc said...

you would make a great next door neighbor. i don't borrow either.

 
At 4/27/2006 9:32 PM, Blogger nanc said...

oh, that was for the farmer.

 
At 4/28/2006 10:26 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm told high fences make good neighbors. LOL!

-FJ

 
At 4/28/2006 10:39 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Now I AM embarrassed. I was trying to be serious. Guess the right half of my brain was pitchin' and the left didn't know it was receivin'.

Where's the exit?

"This way to the great egress...."

Mr. Barnum, your mermaid is ready.

-FJ

 
At 4/28/2006 10:43 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

...half monkey...half fish. I never know which one's directing air traffic over Mt. Helicon.

-FJ

 
At 4/28/2006 10:47 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

...somebody shoot me!

-FJ

 
At 4/28/2006 10:50 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

nanc,

I'd love to be your neighbor.

-FJ

 
At 4/28/2006 10:54 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

...but I doubt we'd have fences, and so we probably wouldn't be very good. But it might be great.

;-)

-FJ

now, I'd better tell my Maker to get the room next to furnace ready for be... and when my wife reads this, the couch...

 
At 4/28/2006 10:57 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
Now my arms are tired! I guess I couldn't hold it any more.

And will the arrow find its target? If so, the force of its impact will be powerful.

Did Hamlet's delay cost him his soul? Were his motives pure? We've been discussing those aspects and have trod into his relationship with Gertrude; I saw a lot of distasteful looks from my students. "Ick!"

 
At 4/28/2006 10:58 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

No more German references! I've got to learn to stick w/English!

 
At 4/28/2006 10:58 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Frost's "Mending Wall"?

 
At 4/28/2006 11:03 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sorry teach, it's been a while since I read my homework. Can I brush up and get back to you?

-FJ

 
At 4/28/2006 11:05 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

My lot here was fenced in 1947, but most of the fence is down now--but not the portion along the main drag; that part stands strong. Except when hit-and-run drivers take down portions.

Am I trying to fence out the mainstream?

 
At 4/28/2006 11:09 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
Some of your comments yesterday went of into the Blogger ether. I think one of them might be "Die, Hippie, Die." From what I can tell, the foul-up was another Blogger glitch. We're having quite a few of those lately.

Anyway, I got email notification, but when I tried to go to that particular blog-article, I got the article-doesn't-exist message.

 
At 4/28/2006 11:10 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

...and thanks for coming to my rescue again, Portia!

-FJ

 
At 4/28/2006 11:15 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

No great loss, always...just a little friendly banter. Thanks for letting me know, though. I sometimes wonder why they used to call it an "Ethernet", cuz half the time it never caught nothin'.

-FJ

 
At 4/28/2006 11:29 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
Frost addressing introvert and extrovert--and other matters, too, of course.

Even extroverts like me have fences even though those fences are not often apparent to others, inside or outside the fence.

 
At 4/28/2006 11:40 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

The Internet is good for one thing though... familiarizing oneself with the "idea' of a "virtual" world.

-FJ

 
At 4/28/2006 11:41 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

...that sometimes needs "fire-walls".

-FJ

 
At 4/28/2006 12:08 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
Off to the movies now. A very rare thing for me to do. Can you guess what I'm going to see?

Later.

 
At 4/28/2006 12:17 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
I just slammed up a new posting before I dash out the door. It is here.

 
At 4/28/2006 12:43 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I sure hope is has nothing to do with Monty Python, because I disavow that my conversation above had ANYTHING to do with Scene 12.

-FJ

So, which is it, "Southpark, The Movie" or "Team America, World Police"?

;-)

I hope you've got a better sense of humor than I have. I think I've tested the limits of my ability to apologize.

"Bring the hemlock!"

 
At 4/28/2006 4:01 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
I went to see United 93, as a sort of prelude to the symposium. I deliberately avoided reading any reviews beforehand, but I'll check the reviews now that I've seen the film. I see a front-page article about the film in today's WaPo.

After the movie was over, most of us sat silently in the theater for a few minutes, then went to our cars and sat some more. It was a tough film to watch.

I usuually wait for the DVD when it comes to comedy/satire.

 
At 4/28/2006 4:45 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
I'm ashamed to admit this...I've never seen a single Monty Python film. Does that make me uncultured?

 
At 4/28/2006 6:27 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Quite the opposite, I believe.

-FJ

 

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