Sunday, April 09, 2006

No More Motown Mondays

You know you're getting older when your favorite music-radio station abandons its format of several decades. Although I like much of what WBIG 100.3 is now playing, some of my nostalgic favorites have just been assigned to my CD-player. Unfortunately, one of my vehicles has no tape- or CD-player, just the AM-FM radio. While some of the oldies on WBIG were of the type before "my day," others were among those hits I discovered when I got my first stereo system.

Excerpt from the April 4, 2006 Washington Post article Oldies a Thing Of the Past At WBIG-FM:
"Elvis has not only left the building — he's leaving the airwaves.

"So, too, are many of his fellow hitmakers from the 1960s and '70s, including the Beach Boys, Aretha Franklin, Simon & Garfunkel and Wilson Pickett.

"In a generational as well as cultural shift, the area's only oldies station, WBIG (100.3 FM), yesterday dropped much of the music that has been a staple of local radio for more than 40 years and replaced it with 'classic' rock from the 1970s and early '80s.

"Out: the cheerful sound of Motown, which appeals to racially diverse audiences, and early Top 40 radio that harks to the civil rights and Vietnam eras.

"In: familiar cuts from rock giants such as Journey, Queen, Supertramp, Aerosmith, the Police and Cheap Trick.

"Still holding on: the Beatles and Rolling Stones, but not the epoch-changing British Invasion hits of the mid-'60s...."

"[I]n one swift move, WBIG consigned a whole swath of iconic pop — hits of the Temptations, the Monkees, James Brown and Mamas & Papas — to the same scrapheap on which radio programmers dumped their Frank Sinatra and Perry Como records more than a decade ago...."
One of the best features of WBIG had been Motown Mondays, when those of us sitting in gridlock could sing along to the hits we used to collect as 45 RPM's. I was partial to anything by The Supremes.

I'm going to miss Motown Mondays as well as the other programming offered by the now-defunct Oldies 100.3. My husband will have a difficult time making the switchover; he's terribly fond of the Beach Boys and doesn't much care for any music beyond 1975.

The change at WBIG is another adjustment to progress, close on the heels of having to do away with our backyard junk and the recent demolition of the oldest house in our neighborhood.

60 Comments:

At 4/09/2006 9:10 PM, Blogger LASunsett said...

Journey,Queen, Supertramp, Aerosmith, the Police and Cheap Trick.

Never liked Journey much. except for the song, "Wheel in the Sky"

Loved and still do love Supertramp immensely. One of my favorite all-time bands.

Early Queen was much better than late Queen, but still loved them and saw them in concert.

Loved the Police, I still like Sting. They blended English rock with a reggae beat like no one has matched since.

Aerosmith, you can have. After their third album, they went into commercial monotony. I hate their new stuff, it's even worse. Their first two albums were clearly their best. I would still listen to any song off of either of those two, but would change the radio station if I heard any others.

Saw Cheap Trick with the Who in Nuremburg, where Adolf held a mass rally once and the photo made every high school history book, in the free world. (I hope he turned over in his grave.) Cheap Trick wasn't bad. Had many I liked better, but they were okay.

I love all rock music from Buddy Holly, Chuck Berry, etc to now. But I do understand how you feel AOW. We had a great 70s album rock station here, it sold and now plays, what you are now hearing on your old station.

Commerce. No ratings, no money. You know the game.

 
At 4/09/2006 9:53 PM, Blogger nanc said...

O.T. - aow - a must see:

http://freedomnowonline.blogspot.com/

please weigh in on all the hard work warren has done to create freedomnow (aka: fern to me) a custom avatar!

 
At 4/09/2006 9:56 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Nanc,
Warren has gone out of his way to do so many of us the favor of creating custom avatars. On my way to Freedom Now's site...

 
At 4/09/2006 11:04 PM, Blogger nanc said...

warren is a gem and i'm not talking cubic zirconia! he is the best.

love your wake up call article - motown is, has, and will ALWAY be my favorite sounds - ooo ooo i bet chur wonderin' how i knew - 'bout chur plans to make me blue...ooo ooo i heard it through the grapevine...love motown - still listen to it and want it played at my wake. who can forget al green, the temptations, aretha, soo many others.

 
At 4/10/2006 1:42 AM, Anonymous Mustang said...

If it isn't music being performed by the Marine Corps Band, I don't listen to it. To me, "Stars and Stripes Forever" sends a more important message than, "She Doan Lub Me No Mo."

 
At 4/10/2006 6:30 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

I wouldn't say that Motown is my favorite genre, and Motown makes up a very small part of my vinyl collection. Still, Motown Mondays was a relief from thinking about complex issues.

I'm going to miss "Mustang Sally"! The minute I bought that Mustang, all my friends started calling me "Mustang ----" and singing the words with my name. LOL.

Maybe WBIG will still play "Mustang Sally" when a car cruise-in is being held. WBIG is/was the station of choice for the many car cruise-ins in the station's area. Sometimes the station was present and did remote broadcasting from the car events.

No word yet as to whether or not the station will play CCR, but I'm hearing lots of Eagles now. All the programming has changed, not just that of Motown Mondays. I'd better keep the batteries for my portable cassette-player charged and do more listening to books-on-tape, I guess.

 
At 4/10/2006 8:05 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Nanc,
We should have a tribute-to-Warren day!

 
At 4/10/2006 8:12 AM, Anonymous the merry widow said...

Now I am REALLY feeling old and creaky! They are using songs I remember in cartoon movies! Sigh... My 2 got such a kick listening to me sing to songs on "Madagascar" or "Sahara"!
nanc-Loved your avatar, by Warren! Freedomnow's is hysterical!
AoW- I see you are an Anis Shorrosh fan! He spoke at our church 2 years ago, what a wise and funny man! He is barely 5', with bright red socks and an American flag tie! He's supposed to come back this summer. I have several of his books, may pick up somemore when he comes back. By the way, I have some friends from Fairfax cty. Is that near you? He was a police officer up there around 20-25 yrs. ago!

Good morning and G*D bless all!
tmw

 
At 4/10/2006 8:20 AM, Blogger nanc said...

aow - EVERYDAY should be "warren day"!

tmw - if you like fern's avatar, you should weigh in on it - it may take him a day or four to recover from it!

 
At 4/10/2006 8:21 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm afraid I never was a big MoTown fan...and Classic Rock doesn't quite cut the mustard anymore. Guess that leaves plenty of buttons on my radio dial for classic Classical and my newest passion... Country.

Boondock, "Little Big Town"...

I feel no shame
I'm proud of where I came from
I was born and raised in the boondocks

One thing I know
No matter where I go
I keep my heart and soul in the boondocks

And I can taste that
Honeysuckle and it's still so sweet

When it grows wild
On the banks down an old camp creek
Yeah, and it calls me like a warm wind blowing

I feel no shame
I'm proud of where I came from
I was born and raised in the boondocks

One thing I know
No matter where I go
I keep my heart and soul in the boondocks

It's where I learned about living
It's where I learned about love
It's where I learned about working hard
And having a little was just enough

It's where I learned about Jesus
And knowing where I stand
You can take it or leave it
This is me
This is who I am

Give me a tin roof
A front porch and a
Gravel road
And that's home to me
It feels like home to me

I feel no shame
I'm proud of where I came from
I was born and raised in the boondocks

One thing I know
No matter where I go
I keep my heart and soul in the boondocks

I keep my heart and soul in the boondocks


-FJ

 
At 4/10/2006 9:00 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Merry Widow,
Yes, Fairfax City is pretty close to me. I know the city well.

I missed hearing Dr. Shorrosh when he spoke in the area here last spring. I was laid up from a car accident. If he's in this area again, I hope to hear him speak. All reports I get about this man are wonderful accolades.

Several months ago, I posted here his "Twenty Year Plan." See this. Quite a few commenters stopped by.

One of Dr. Shorrosh's books was the first I read, post-9/11. I heard him on TV right after the attacks; one of his books was immediately available at the local library.

 
At 4/10/2006 9:02 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
Country? What to say?

I like the "old country," somewhat of the type in O Brother, Where Art Thou? Most of the newer country doesn't do much for me.

I find it difficult to drive when listening to classical music; my attention is taken from the road as I analyze form, modulations, etc.

 
At 4/10/2006 9:07 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Nanc,
Tomorrow is supposedly MTP's birthday and celebrated as such in some Islamic countries. Make your rounds and notify various ones. You know whom I mean. LOL.

See this for further info.

My posting will go up later today. You know that I don't want to miss this opportunity. LOL.

Go ye forth and collect fatwas.

 
At 4/10/2006 10:09 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Southpark, "Little bit of Country"...

[South Park, day 4, town square. The rally is still going on, and a reporter files the following report]

Tom: Tom, I'm standing in the town square where the war rally has been going on for an incredible eighty-seven hours. The crowd still appears to be split right down the middle - half of them support country music, and the other half rock-n-roll. Let's listen in....


---

Mr. Mackey: All right everyone, thank you all for comin' out to protest the war, m'kay? [people within the crowd clap. Randy comes out dressed in an Elvis outfit].

Skeeter: Don't kid yourselves. These people have come out to support our troops, right?! [raises a fist. Other people within the crowd clap]

Mr. Mackey: And now, Randy Marsh is gonna sing a protest song he wrote about the war.

Skeeter: Oh no you don't! We're doing our pro-war song first!

Jimbo: Yeah! The last thing these people want is a bleedin'-heart rock protest song!

Mayor McDaniels: [intervenes] People, I told you, you have to share the stage.

Randy: Nobody wants to here another pro-war country song!

Skeeter: Well excuse me if...
I'm a little bit country.

Randy: Well I'm a little bit rock-n-roll!

Skeeter: I'm a little for supportin' our troops.

Randy: And I'm a little for bringin' them home.

Skeeter: I believe freedom isn't free.

Randy: No, but war shouldn't be our goal.

Skeeter: We must defend our country.

Randy: If it means war, then we say NO!

Somebody: Yeehaw!


-FJ

 
At 4/10/2006 10:21 AM, Blogger nanc said...

aow - once while my oldest daughter and i were going shopping we were listening to classical and at a stoplight i was so relaxed my car rolled gently into the car in front of me - we got out and assessed and laughed at the situation as there were no visible damages. damnable classical music! here's the rest of the story:

while in macy's later that day i came sweeping around a rack with my cart and ran smack dab into the same woman's cart just about knocking her to the floor! well, when all was said and done, we had the best laugh.

i will definitely spread the word on the aforementioned. a word for you all - madzionist is going to tell the passover story this week and storyteller he is! i love when he gives the straight skinny on jewish feast, fast and holy days. if you haven't had the pleasure of seeing madze's versions, you don't know the whole enchilada:

http://www.madzionist.blogspot.com/

 
At 4/10/2006 10:48 AM, Anonymous the merry widow said...

AoW-Sorry, I meant county!
nanc-Last year for Passover, we had a Messianic Jew come and lead us through the Hagganah. Wonderful and enriching experence! Look forward to MadZ's take!
I usually listen to movie soundtracks myself. Only problem is when a really exciting piece plays, driving through some of the local towns speeding is a good way to get a ticket! You are also right about Mo Town, miss some of those groups!

tmw

 
At 4/10/2006 11:06 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
Little bit of this and a little bit of that--sounds like some of the rallies at Geroge Mason College, when it was part of UVA.

GMC of UVA, now GMU, has always been a rather "apathetic" campus. I attribute that to the fact that many who attend there are working their way through college and are commuter students.

Nanc,
See? Classical music causes some problems while on the road. But some classical is a soother before bedtime.

I'll have to check out Madze's Passover story.

Merry Widow,
I once got a speeding ticket while listening to "Love Her Madly" (The Doors). Put Doors into the CD-player, and watch your speed creep up.

Movie soundtracks are good. I have several, including that of Jaws, Patton, and Deliverance.

 
At 4/10/2006 11:33 AM, Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

Martha and the Vandellas rule.

 
At 4/10/2006 11:34 AM, Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

Hank Williams also rules.

 
At 4/10/2006 11:42 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Duck,
Hank Williams--the original of "Born to Lose" and "I'm So Lonesome I Could Cry"?

 
At 4/10/2006 11:48 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

That's what I like about you mr. ducky. You're a little bit country, and a little rock 'n roll. And like me, you don't mind carrying around the baggage that often comes with hypocrisy.

Southpark, "I'm a Little Bit Country"...

Cartman: The Founding Fathers want you all to know that we can disagree all we want, as long as we agree that America kicks ass.

Skeeter: Hey I'm a little bit country

Randy: And I'm a little bit rock-n-roll-eh [Cartman takes his mic and backs out of the scene, leaving Randy and Skeeter to sing together]

Skeeter: I'll be the muscle of America

Randy: And me, I'll be the caring soul.

Together: When you put us together you get a nation with one goal To thrive and prosper, with a little country and rock and roll.

Randy: Come on up here, everybody! [the crowd surges onto the stage. Stan and Kyle look dumbfounded]

Everybody: We're a little bit country, and we're a little bit rock-n-roll

Stuart: We can be a nation that believe in war,

Mr. Mackey: And still tells the world that we don't. [moments later the back of the stage begins to rise, revealing guests from many previous episodes]

Everybody: Let the flag for hyprocisy fly high from every pole We're a little bit country, and we're a little bit rock-n-roll

Randy: Well, goodnight everybody. It sure has been great bringing you a hundred episodes.

Skeeter: We want to thank our guests, the pro-war people. [shown, including Halfy. Some applause is heard] And the anti-war people. [shown. Some applause is heard]

Stan: What the hell are they doing now?

Kyle: [covers his nose and shuts his eyes tight] Ah I don't know.

Everybody: For the war, against, the war, WHO CARES?? One hundred episodes! [Randy and Skeeter perform some nifty footwork as they finish the song]

Kyle: I hate this town. Ah I really really do.


-FJ

 
At 4/10/2006 11:49 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Duck,
I see from your profile an interest in The Anthology of American Folk Music.

At what point does popular music become folk music? Just something to ponder on a Monday.

 
At 4/10/2006 11:58 AM, Blogger nanc said...

i'd like to know what on earth was meant by this song:

"Good morning starshine
The earth says "Hello"
You twinkle above us
We twinkle below
Good morning starshine
You lead us along
My love and me as we sing
Our early morning singing saong
Gliddy glup gloopy
Nibby nabby noopy la la la lo lo
Sabba Sibby sabba
Nooby abba nabba le le lo lo
Tooby ooby walla nooby abba nabba
Early morning singing song

Good morning starshine
You lead us along
My love and me as we sing
Our early morning singing song
Gliddy glup gloopy
Nibby nabby noopy la la la lo lo
Sabba Sibby sabba
Nooby abba nabba le le lo lo
Tooby ooby walla nooby abba nabba
Early morning singing song
Singing a song, humming a song
Singing a song loving a song
Laughing a song
Sing the son, sing the song
Song the sing
Song, song, song, sing
Sing, sing, sing, song"

repeat the chorus and a fatwa will ensue.

 
At 4/10/2006 11:59 AM, Blogger nanc said...

plucky does appear to have good taste in music.

 
At 4/10/2006 12:09 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Nanc,
I can sing all of "Good Morning, Starshine." I hate to think what that skill might mean!

Did that music have something to do with The Prime of Miss Jean Brodie? Maybe I'm mixed up on that.

Duck is a movie expert. Maybe he'll quack by and inform us as to the song's meaning and as to its use in a movie (if any).

 
At 4/10/2006 12:27 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

My impression was that nothing "on earth" was meant by it. It's a rather ethereal tune...

ADJECTIVE: 1. Characterized by lightness and insubstantiality; intangible. 2. Highly refined; delicate. See synonyms at airy. 3a. Of the celestial spheres; heavenly. b. Not of this world; spiritual. 4. Chemistry Of or relating to ether.

ETYMOLOGY: From Latin aetherius, from Greek aitherios, from aithr, upper air.


...but I'm probably wrong. But you'd have to go back to the days when the Red Diaper babies were feuding with their parents to understand and prove me wrong...

I CAME UPON A CHILD OF GOD
HE WAS WALKING ALONG THE ROAD
WHEN I ASKED HIM WHERE ARE YOU GOING?
THIS HE TOLD ME

I'M GOING DOWN TO YASKERS FARM
THINK I'LL JOIN A ROCK N' ROLL BAND
I'LL CAMP OUT ON THE LAND
I'LL TRY TO SET MY SOUL FREE

WE ARE STAR DUST
WE ARE GOLDEN
AND WE'VE GOT TO GET OURSELVES
BACK TO THE GARDEN


...and the whole contoversy around Dylan "going electric"...

One of the tactics of the "old schooler's" and travellers within the COMINTERN and the ISM was to wrap themselves in the flags of local culture and thereby "bond" with the people of the masses... become one of them... join... form a "union" with them.

Dylan "broke" with the old school... embraced a more Dionysian form of activism (SDS pre-weathermen & Blank Panther) that was very very subtle and counter-intuitive. A new form that embraced Freudian psychology and concentrated on the subliminal.

but then, perhaps I digress too far...

-FJ

 
At 4/10/2006 12:29 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

mr. ducky,

I would be very interested in your analysis, also.

-FJ

 
At 4/10/2006 12:32 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

That was a serious question to Duck.

 
At 4/10/2006 12:39 PM, Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

Well, I think it was a critical moment when Dylan picked up that Fender.

Dylan just wanted a fresh sound. One thing I will say about Dylan is that he understands traditional music. "Good as I Been to You" and "World Gone Wrong" are great, great albums. A definiticve, Deliah, Me and My Uncle, Blood in My Eyes. Dylan knew that the Mississippi Shieks kick Schubert's arse.

Dylan also extended Hank Williams and Woody and made popular song personal. This is where things started to fall down. He did it well especially in Blood on the Highway but much less talented songwriters merely bore us thinking that their story is interesting.

If you are going to make the popular song personal, make sure you can pull of something like "I'm So Lonely I Could Cry".

 
At 4/10/2006 12:39 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Of course, I mean subliminal in the same sense as Kant did in his 1764 "Observations on the Feeling of the Beautiful and Sublime".

One of these days I really DO need to get around to reading Burke's 1756 "Essay on the Sublime and the Beautiful" or perhaps even Longinus' "On the Sublime".

I'm sure they'd be at least as interesting as Roussea's Reveries.

-FJ

 
At 4/10/2006 12:41 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

mr. ducky...

What about the 5th dimension tune???

-FJ

 
At 4/10/2006 12:41 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
IMO, "Starshine" is more about the beauty of sights and, more importantly, sounds. I like "Starshine" much better than "Louie, Louie." What does the latter mean? I could always follow Roger Miller, odd though some of his syllables were.

Now, Crosby, Stills, and Nash--that is another matter. As to Dylan, I agree with you, Farmer. I can take some Dylan but cannot stand to watch him.

Good thing that Woodstock wasn't at property whose owners I personally know. THAT would've been ugly.

A few people I knew attended Woodstock. They're all rich capitalists now. LOL.

 
At 4/10/2006 12:50 PM, Blogger nanc said...

this not for the fainthearted:

http://www.dansimmons.com/news/message.htm

o.t., but food for thought - it's long, but quite interesting. regarding impending dhimmitude.

 
At 4/10/2006 1:00 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
You might want to have a look at the link which Nanc just left. Some Greek history there.

 
At 4/10/2006 1:31 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thanks always, I will. For now, however, I have to go run a few errands.

-FJ

 
At 4/10/2006 4:12 PM, Blogger American Crusader said...

Nobody likes getting old but it sure beats the alternative.

 
At 4/10/2006 4:46 PM, Blogger Iran Watch said...

I use Sirius. You can listen to anything commercial free.
"A few people I knew attended Woodstock. They're all rich capitalists now. LOL."
If as many people who claim to have attended Woodstock actually had went...

 
At 4/10/2006 5:07 PM, Blogger nanc said...

a.c. said,

"Nobody likes getting old but it sure beats the alternative."

well, maybeeeee - i'm actually looking forward to my second childhood!

i like was dee robertson says about getting old:

"aging is NOT for sissies!"

 
At 4/10/2006 6:11 PM, Blogger Kyle said...

I grew up in the sixties and seventies and I cannot STAND the overplayed pop hits of that era. OH MY god!!! I had to hear that crap too much when it was popular and they overplayed it back then. And I have been hearing it ever sense. In malls, in resturants, in stores. It's like torture.
I think after forty years its time to retire something, at least in public places.

 
At 4/10/2006 6:12 PM, Blogger nanc said...

correction:

"what" dee robertson said..."

geez, beak is rubbing off on me.

 
At 4/10/2006 6:15 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

nanc,

Loved the story. Three words...phobos, kerdos, doxa. Why those? Plato's chariot in "Phaedrus" only had two horses (not three). An old philosopher's trick for embedding the answer and an unanswered question? Machiavelli did it all the time in his "Discourses on Titus Livy"... Leo Strauss discloses a few of them in his "Commentary" on the same.

The "not ruthless enough" at Syracuse is also inappropriate. The Athenians were plenty "ruthless". It was an issue of leadership. The Syracusan's had two Spartan polemarch's in whom they had unquestioning, unshakable confidence. Another old philosopher's trick. The art of making the obvious "mistake".

The Syracusan's were ruthless... but it was critical that they concealed this ruthlessness nand the fate of the Athenians massacred after the attempt to escape into the interior of Sicily.

-FJ

 
At 4/10/2006 6:51 PM, Blogger MissingLink said...

AOW,
I hear sometimes some of my old favourite songs "re-done" for all these new singers.
You know you're getting older when you say to a 19 year old oh this is so and so song, and they give you this blank stare because they think it is a "brand new" hit.

 
At 4/10/2006 6:56 PM, Blogger nanc said...

aow - thanks for the link at fern's to the thread that started it all! memories, like the corners of my mind...dust...

fern is such a good sport~!

 
At 4/10/2006 7:27 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
I defer to your greater knowledge on matters of ancient history. But failed leadership is even worse than lack of ruthlessness, isn't it? A lot of Greek mythology touches on failed leadership as the cause of much grief.

Missing Link,
I hear sometimes some of my old favourite songs "re-done" for all these new singers.

I've heard a few of these. You guessed it--I prefer the original versions.

Nanc,
Dare I say "Fern"? Yes, a good sport. Now I understand the "headdress" atop the avatar.

 
At 4/10/2006 7:48 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Kyle,
I didn't discover music-radio until 1967 when I was finally able to drive by myself. In the house, my parents kept the radio tuned to talk shows on the rare occasions when the radio was on at all.

In fact, the radio was forbidden to be on in the car at all when my father was driving--he didn't like any distractions from the road. Maybe that's why he had only two car accidents--one as a very young man and once, later, when somebody broadsided him. No tickets for speeding either.

But I can understand the overload you mentioned. I suffered that overload with "Bridge over Troubled Water" when I was in college. That song was a favorite of the lefty philosophy prof, and he played it over and over again until the halls reeked of it.

 
At 4/10/2006 8:00 PM, Blogger nanc said...

what aow! that warren thinks i'm a birdbrain? or that fern's a nutcase? lol!

 
At 4/10/2006 8:57 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Both Athenian generals who laid siege to Syracuse (Nicias and Demosthenes) were seasoned veterans (Plato used the Nicias character in his "Laches" dialogue [On Courage} as an intellectual/philosophical foil for contrasting with the crusty old Dionysian/ and impulsive general Laches) & Demosthenes was responsible for the creation of the Athenian outpost at Pylos, where a subsequent Athenian victory earned a short-lived "truce" w/Sparta (a couple of years w/Spartan "hostages").

So Athenian "local" generalship on the battlefield was not the real issue (*Although one could argue its' strategy of building static walls of circumvallation was ill-advised, it was, bhowever, "standard" technology for the day, defeated by the Syracusans building counter walls that would eventually "flank" the attempt to surround the landward side of Syracuse...it was a battle of engineers)(One should also note that the long walls of Athens that reached to the port were a prominent defense feature and that those whom Athens subdued were frequently required to tear down the walls that either surrounded their cities, or give up a citadel within the city to an Athenian garrison)

But the original motive initiating the expedition to Siciliy had been "rhetorically" whipped up (in a popular "democratic" manner) by Alcibiades, Pericle's nephew and frequent "symbol" of a youth who needed Socrate's education and guidance in Platonic dialogues... ie - "Symposium" (On Love) and many others...one of those whom Athens charged Socrate's w/corrupting and therefore sentenced to death by hemlock in 400 BC near the end of the war.

And Alcibiades had been the "spark" that lit the ill-advised Sicilian campaign. Originally, Alcibiades was to be one of the expedition generals, but was "recalled" shortly after arrival in Siciliy for having drunkenly destroyed certain (ahem) religious symbols (Hermes' priapus was at every Athenian gate to warn visitors to private homes who's castle they were entering).

Alcibiades subsequently defected to the Spartans where he impregnated one of the Spartan "queens"... then to the Persians where he advised Tisaphernes (sic?)... and then back to the Athenians (as the war had been nearly lost...Athens wanted to "cut a deal" & make Alcibiades one of a small group of oligarch's who would rule Athens in the name of Sparta).

And so, if there was a "leadership" problem, it was a structural "systemic" one... of "democracy" itself... of the "ignorant masses" directing the affairs of state and use their own government to plunder others and thereby enrich themselves.

In the dialogue, you will recall the "mistake". Central (middle position) in the names of the three Platonic horses was "self-interest". Was this the mistake the "author" is calling our attention to? Perhaps.

-FJ

 
At 4/10/2006 9:08 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Is this the "category error" that the author alludes to in the run-up to the traveller's history lesson about the Peloponnesian War?

-FJ

 
At 4/10/2006 9:22 PM, Blogger nanc said...

i cannot honestly answer that, f.j., but that's perhaps because i was looking at the entertainment and perhaps future value of the piece. i don't know if i have the capacity to dissect the story as you have. i'm not afraid to plead ignorance on the points you have brought to the table. i've had very little experience in the humanities. your points are, i'm sure quite valid.

 
At 4/11/2006 7:55 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Plato held that certain poets, like Homer, were "divinely inspired". I'm not quite sure I would go that far, but the right hemisphere of the human brain is extremely "intuitive" and muse-ical. The source of "Freudian" wit, and those everyday "slips" (Freud, "Psychopathology of Everyday Life").

But I suspect that the author's work was also very artfully done, as well (in other words, not purely for entertainment value). It was meant to be slowly and subliminally digested.

One of these days I'll get around to reading "Gravity's Rainbow", a Leftist's foray into the subliminal.

-FJ

 
At 4/11/2006 8:17 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Farmer,
Beak has up a "Farmer John Special." Just letting you know.

 
At 4/11/2006 8:43 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
And so, if there was a "leadership" problem, it was a structural "systemic" one... of "democracy" itself... of the "ignorant masses" directing the affairs of state and use their own government to plunder others and thereby enrich themselves.

As in political lobbies?

Off to read the links you posted.

 
At 4/11/2006 9:07 AM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
From this:

A woman, speaking about a game invented by her children and called by them "the man in the box," said "the manx in the boc." I could [p. 83] readily understand her mistake. It was while analysing her dream, in which her husband is depicted as very generous in money matters -- just the reverse of reality -- that she made this speech-blunder. The day before she had asked for a new set of furs, which her husband denied her, claiming that he could not afford to spend so much money. She upbraided him for his stinginess, "for putting away so much into the strongbox," and mentioned a friend whose husband has not nearly his income, and yet he presented his wife with a mink coat for her birthday. The mistake is now comprehensible. The word manx (manks) reduces itself to the "minks" which she longs for, and the box refers to her husband's stinginess.

The above is one of many examples in that chapter. I don't go along with all the analyses in that chapter, BTW.

I wonder what Freud would make of my constantly making similar errors only when talking to my lifelong friend? My errors of speech with her have become a tradition with her and me. But only I make the mistakes.

Now, back to Freud.

 
At 4/11/2006 12:04 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dream interpretation is a little more complex... you'd have to really spend some time reading Freud's "Interpretation of Dreams" to better understand the "wish fullfillment" nature of dreams, the repressive inversions, and understand temporary (nightly) memory storage and conversion (RAM to ROM) and indexing in the "dream state (REM sleep) via matching "syllabic" or "sound" based (left hemi) engrams and the hemispheric pairings to visuals across the corpus callosum and re-distribution of trapped energies (psychic/ emotional) to become more convinced.... not that I understand it very well myself.

And perhaps you should try to analyze one of your own "slips". I once analyzed one of my "friends" inability to remember the events of a previous day's events (He couldn't remember the "name" of the movie he had seen the day before - Pirates of the Carribean, but could relate the story in detail) and since have been able to understand a number of my own.

I find many of my "typo's" extremely amusing upon subsequent analysis. An "escape" of wit.

As to your making these slips only with this particular individual... sounds like there might be some "repressed" memories associated with him/her. But that's something you'd have to discover on your own.

-FJ

 
At 4/11/2006 12:16 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

FJ,
Most of the slips are quite funny in nature. But my friend and I can rarely recall the recent ones and remember only the first ones.

I attribute some of my slips to our always being in a hurry. We don't seem to be able to adjust to the idea of unlimited-long-distance phone service.

I rarely make the mistakes face-to-face, BTW. The vast majority of my slips are made by telephone, and such has been the problem from day one. Maybe the subconscious desire to be face-to-face? My friend and I have gone as long as 16 years between personal visits.

Now, if I start analyzing my many typos, I'll really go nuts.

 
At 4/11/2006 9:54 PM, Blogger The Truth Hurts said...

AOW:

3 words:

XM satellite radio.

 
At 4/12/2006 12:38 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Truth,
More tech stuff? I'll be on overload!

 
At 4/13/2006 2:44 AM, Blogger kevin said...

I have sattelite radio, there's a great selection of most styles of music and no commercials. It's not perfect, but it's the next best thing to my CD collection. BTW,
Hank, Martha, Dylan...you guys would make good dj's

 
At 4/16/2006 2:44 PM, Blogger Debbie said...

Oldies but goodies is ALL I ever listen to. I love those 60's 70's and 80's music.

 
At 4/16/2006 9:15 PM, Blogger Always On Watch said...

Today the WaPo had another article about the changes at WBIG. My husband and I aren't the only ones who will miss the oldies.

Satellite radio is the solution, I guess. Or maybe my CD collection.

Our dish-TV has a few oldies stations, but listening at home just isn't as good as crusing to the tunes.

 

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